Do indestructible planeswalkers lose counters?

Planeswalkers with indestructible will still have loyalty counters removed from them as they are dealt damage. If a planeswalker with indestructible has no loyalty counters, it will still be put into its owner‘s graveyard, as the rule that does this doesn‘t destroy the planeswalker.

What does indestructible mean on planeswalkers?

The indestructible keyword prevents a permanent from being destroyed by damage or effects that say "destroy". However, it does not prevent effects that reduce loyalty counters on planeswalkers.

For example, if you make Gideon Jura indestructible with Boros Charm, he will not be destroyed if he takes 5 damage. But he will still lose 5 loyalty counters. Indestructible prevents the planeswalker card itself from going to the graveyard, but it does nothing to stop the loss of loyalty counters.

Let‘s look at some more specific scenarios:

• Your opponent attacks your indestructible Gideon Jura with a 5/5 creature. Gideon survives but loses 5 loyalty counters.

• You cast Hero‘s Downfall targeting your indestructible Dovin Baan. Dovin is not destroyed, but still loses 3 loyalty counters from Hero‘s Downfall.

• Your indestructible Sarkhan the Masterless gets hit by a Shock. Sarkhan stays on the battlefield but loses 2 loyalty counters.

As you can see, indestructible protects the planeswalker permanent but does not interact with its loyalty total. All sources of damage or loyalty loss still apply.

Granting indestructible to planeswalkers

Here are some ways to make your planeswalkers indestructible in the Magic: The Gathering trading card game:

• Boros Charm – Instant that gives target permanent or player indestructible until end of turn.

• Darksteel Plate – Artifact equipment that grants equipped creature indestructible. Can be attached to planeswalkers.

• Withstand Death – Instant that gives target creature or planeswalker indestructible until end of turn.

• Heroic Intervention – Instant that makes permanents you control indestructible until end of turn.

• Teferi‘s Protection – Instant that phases out all permanents you control, making them indestructible until they phase back in.

Some of these methods grant indestructible temporarily until end of turn, while others like Darksteel Plate make it a permanent effect. When evaluating these cards, pay attention to duration and any other restrictions like equipping costs.

Is indestructible good on planeswalkers?

Indestructible does prevent your planeswalker from being outright destroyed by effects like Hero‘s Downfall or a board wipe. This can be beneficial to keep your planeswalker on the board.

However, because damage still removes loyalty counters, indestructible doesn‘t actually protect the planeswalker‘s loyalty total. Often, reducing a planeswalker‘s loyalty to 0 is just as effective as destroying it.

So whether indestructible is useful depends on the board state and matchup:

• Indestructible stops destruction-based removal like Vraska‘s Contempt, Mortify, Casualties of War. This leaves your planeswalker alive.

• It doesn‘t save you from exile effects like Anguished Unmaking or Utter End which still remove the planeswalker.

• If the main threat is damage-based removal or combat damage, indestructible preserves your permanent.

• Against aggressive decks with many creatures, indestructible extends planeswalker lifespan.

• In control matchups with more sorcery-speed removal, indestructible has less impact.

Analyze the expected threats and board state when deciding whether to invest in granting indestructible. It can provide longevity but doesn‘t protect loyalty.

Counters interaction

While indestructible prevents destruction, -1/-1 counters can still kill indestructible creatures if it brings their toughness to 0 or less. Proliferate is a keyword that allows you to add a counter of any type already on a permanent. This includes adding loyalty counters to planeswalkers.

For example, if I control a planeswalker and cast Contagion Clasp, I can choose to proliferate and add an additional loyalty counter to my planeswalker. Or if I have an Animation Module in play which grants me a proliferate trigger whenever a +1/+1 counter is placed, I could use that to quickly boost planeswalker loyalty as well.

Some weak planeswalkers

Here are some planeswalkers often considered underpowered or weak options:

Planeswalker	Reason
Tibalt, the Fiend Blooded	High casting cost, weak abilities
Oko, the Trickster	Banned for being too powerful originally
Nissa Revane	Ultimates rarely achievable in format
Nicol Bolas, the Deceiver	Weak impact for high mana cost
Nissa, Steward of Elements	Small uptick doesn‘t protect herself

I would agree these are generally poor performers. Tibalt suffers from both a high initial cost and +1 ability that is nearly useless in many board states. Oko and Bolas demonstrate the risk of pushing mana costs too low for powerful effects that snowball out of control.

Nissa Revane‘s ultimate takes way too long to reach in competitive formats where games end faster. And Nissa, Steward‘s low impact +1 does not provide enough loyalty growth to survive long.

Nicol Bolas‘ defeat

The elder dragon planeswalker Nicol Bolas was defeated in a magic duel by the samurai Tetsuo Umezawa in the backstory of Magic: The Gathering. Stripped of his powers, Bolas lost to Umezawa in the psychic confines of the latter‘s mindscape, resulting in the destruction of Bolas‘ physical form.

This event is a pivotal moment in Magic lore, as the formerly invincible Bolas suffers his first true defeat. It sets up the weakened Bolas to slowly regain his powers over time, holding a grudge against the worlds and planeswalkers who had opposed him, leading to centuries of machinations.

The planeswalker uniqueness rule

Unlike other cards, you can only control one copy of any individual planeswalker card at a time. So while you can control multiple different planeswalkers, you cannot have two copies of the same card on the battlefield. This is referred to as the "planeswalker uniqueness rule".

For example, you could have both Liliana, Dreadhorde General and Chandra, Novice Pyromancer in play simultaneously. But you cannot control two instances of Jace, Cunning Castaway. If a second enters the battlefield, you must put one into the graveyard.

This rule prevents certain powerful combinations and limits ultimate ability uses. It adds another layer of strategy to playing planeswalkers effectively. You must carefully manage which ones are in play and evaluate whether to cast a second copy of one you already control.

Deathtouch vs planeswalkers

Creatures with deathtouch destroy any creature dealt damage, but planeswalkers are not creatures. They lose loyalty normally, so a 1/1 deathtoucher would only remove 1 loyalty counter from a planeswalker upon dealing combat damage.

Let‘s compare some examples:

• Your opponent attacks your 5 loyalty Garruk Wildspeaker with a Vampire Nighthawk (1/3 deathtouch, lifelink). Garruk survives and goes down to 4 loyalty while your opponent gains 3 life.

• Your Typhoid Rats (1/1 deathtouch) blocks a 5/5 creature. The Typhoid Rats destroy the 5/5 creature in combat thanks to deathtouch.

• You attack your opponent‘s 4 loyalty Liliana with your 2/2 deathtouch creature. Liliana loses 2 loyalty and survives. Your creature is not destroyed.

The key takeaway is deathtouch only triggers against creatures, so planeswalkers interact normally. You can exploit this by attacking planeswalkers with deathtouchers to remove loyalty counters without losing your creature.

Indestructible vs hexproof

Indestructible and hexproof are both protective keywords in Magic, but they function differently:

	Indestructible	Hexproof
Prevents	Destruction from damage or "destroy" effects	Being targeted by opponents‘ spells/abilities
Vulnerable to	Exile (e.g. Utter End), -1/-1 counters, sacrifice effects	Board wipes, deathtouch, non-targeting removal

Indestructible is more specialized against targeted destruction-based removal and damage. Hexproof gives generalized protection from being directly targeted. Both still have vulnerabilities based on what they don‘t prevent.

If your meta has a lot of board wipes, indestructible helps more. Against hand disruption and creature kill spells, hexproof is stronger. Evaluate your expected threats when choosing a defense.

Dealing with deathtouch

Deathtouch creatures pose a threat due their ability to trade up on power and toughness in combat. Here are some tactics to handle opposing deathtouchers:

• Instant speed removal – Kill deathtouch creatures at instant speed before combat damage with spells like Murder to prevent unfavorable trades.

• Use your own deathtouch creature – Block with your deathtoucher to kill their attacker. But watch out for first strike.

• Block with indestructible creatures – Indestructible prevents death from deathtouch so you can block profitably.

• First strike combat damage – Deal first strike damage before normal deathtouch combat damage.

• Counter deathtouch abilities – Neutralize the ability with cards like Disallow.

• Sacrifice effects – Kill deathtouchers by forcing them to be sacrificed with cards like Despark.

Proactively use these angles of attack to prevent deathtouch creatures from generating card advantage through creature removal.

Origins of planeswalkers

Planeswalkers as spell cards were first introduced to Magic in the Lorwyn set in 2007. But the concept of powerful planeswalking mages existed long before that in the storylines of Magic‘s expansions.

The character Urza from the Weatherlight Saga was an immensely powerful planeswalker with abilities far exceeding cards of the time. Other characters were later retroactively identified as planeswalkers in Magic‘s lore.

In much earlier sets, mechanics like the planeswalker damage rule represented flavorful connections to planeswalkers in the game‘s history and lore. But players could not directly control planeswalker cards until years later.

Planeswalker cards sought to capture that immense lore power in the actual gameplay. Their unique mechanics of loyalty abilities made them play unlike any other card type.

Using planeswalkers as commanders

The default commander or general in Commander format games of Magic is a legendary creature. However, some planeswalker cards also specifically say "this card can be your commander".

For example, the five mono-color planeswalkers from Magic Origins like Kytheon, Hero of Akros/Gideon, Battle-Forged all have the ability to be commander.

Any such planeswalker can be used to lead your Commander deck rather than the typical legendary creature commander. Having a planeswalker commander offers powerful consistency through repeatedly using their loyalty abilities. It also means they cannot be tucked or exiled since commanders go back to the command zone.

The tradeoff is planeswalkers are vulnerable to combat damage when attacking your opponent‘s life total is not as relevant. You need ways to protect your commander and supplement card advantage planeswalkers provide slower incremental value via loyalty abilities compared to creature cast triggers.

Proliferate planeswalker loyalty

Since proliferate can add counters that are already present on permanents, you can use it to add loyalty to your planeswalkers. This is a nice synergy that essentially skips planeswalkers ahead in their progression towards their ultimate loyalty ability.

Some examples of sources of proliferate that can help planeswalkers:

• Tezzeret the Seeker‘s +1 ability – Proliferates every turn to quickly build Tezzeret‘s loyalty.

• Contagion Clasp/Engine/Cards – Artifacts that grant proliferate abilities.

• Evolution Sage – Creature that grants all your permanents proliferate whenever a land ETBs under your control.

• Throne of Geth – Legendary artifact that can proliferate for 2 mana.

• Inexorable Tide – Enchantment granting a free proliferate every turn.

Use these kinds of proliferate engines to speed up planeswalker ultimates. You can even combine multiple proliferate sources to really accelerate loyalty growth.

When should you grant indestructible to planeswalkers?

As we‘ve discussed, indestructible prevents destruction but does not stop loyalty loss on planeswalkers. Here are some guidelines on when it can be impactful:

• Against creature-heavy aggressive decks – Extends planeswalker lifespan when repeated attacks are the main threat.

• On planeswalkers with high starting loyalty – Starting at 5+ loyalty gives them time to build further even if taking damage.

• On planeswalkers with strong uptick abilities – Keeping them alive means more activations of powerful positive loyalty abilities.

• When you expect sorcery-speed removal – Inspector board wipes, flexible instant speed removal nullifies indestructible more.

• On lower mana value planeswalkers – Cheaper planeswalkers have less overall investment, so keeping them around longer is more valuable.

Evaluate the board, matchup, and card specifics before deciding whether to devote resources into an indestructible grant. It can provide a longevity boost but won‘t save loyalty counters.

Should you make all your planeswalkers indestructible?

Indestructible is powerful, but handing it out indiscriminately can be an over-investment. Here are some risks:

• Too many resources spent on protecting planeswalkers not advancing your board.

• Indestructible does not affect loyalty counters which are how you lose planeswalkers.

• Opponents can still remove indestructible planeswalkers through exile or sacrifice effects.

• Overvaluing indestructible may lead to misplays like not plus‘ing loyalty enough.

I would recommend more targeted use of indestructible. Prioritize high mana planeswalkers that would be costly to recast from the graveyard. Avoid "protecting" weak planeswalkers with low starting loyalty that will just tick down and die anyway.

And you can still lose indestructible planeswalkers to exile, -1/-1 counters, and other non-destruction based removal. So do not rely on indestructible as your sole defense. Use it as part of a layered planeswalker protection strategy.

Final thoughts

We‘ve explored numerous interactions, applications, and strategies around indestructible as it relates to planeswalkers. While indestructible can be very powerful in the right circumstances, it does have defined limitations. evaluate your matchup and board state to determine whether it warrants the card resources to protect your planeswalkers.

I hope this comprehensive guide has provided lots of insightful technical details as well as thought-provoking strategic considerations to help determine how and when to utilize indestructible on your planeswalkers most effectively. Please let me know if you have any other related questions!